cimorene: cartoony drawing of a woman's head in profile giving dubious side-eye (serious)
Cimorene ([personal profile] cimorene) wrote2008-04-13 03:03 pm
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When a feminist isn't a "feminist"

I spent hours yesterday and today reading up on this trainwreck in the feminist blogosphere after links from [livejournal.com profile] miriam_heddy and [livejournal.com profile] ciderpress. It's about racism and intellectual theft, and how white feminists use their priviledge, consciously or un-, to coopt the voices of women of colour, claiming their ideas in the process of making those ideas heard without attribution instead of working to make the voices of women of colour heard as well.

As my mouth fell slowly open in horror yesterday, I understood for the first time why some women who believe in the systematic oppression of women and believe that it's wrong choose not to call themselves "feminists." For the first time, I understood that this has nothing to do with a misunderstanding of terminology on their part. What this battle over terminology has to do with is yet another one-way visible veil of priviledge blinding us over here on the priviledged side of the veil. We have the luxury of saying that the history of the movement doesn't matter because of the dictionary definition, of all things. We have the luxury of saying, "But look at the dictionary! You meet the dictionary criteria, so if you claim not to be a feminist, you're wrong." But women of colour don't have that luxury. They can't define a political movement by the dictionary in defiance of its history and its present when it's busy silencing them, instead of doing what it says on the tin and working to change their marginalisation.

I'm ashamed and disgusted that I didn't see this before and that I inadvertently contributed to the attempts of systemic priviledge to silence the marginalised by arguing this point with them before. I'm sorry, belatedly, to my friends and to anyone who's listened to me say those things, whatever side of the fence they're standing on. I was wrong.

[identity profile] dreamnnightmare.livejournal.com 2008-04-13 02:24 pm (UTC)(link)
take everything you just said is given. I didn't see it myself before, but it should not be a surprise. However, I've met quite a few women who see the oppression of women in our society and hate it, but who refuse to call themselves feminists. I don't think very many of these women do it because of the further oppression by white feminists of feminist women of color. I think most of these women do it because they don't want their family members and coworkers and fellow churchgoers to think of them as liberal extremists. Even though some of them are. Now, I'm not going to argue this is a terrible thing. If you can do the work of liberation, and conceal that fact from people you have to see every day who would harass you about it, maybe that's the way to go. You save more of your strength for the real struggle. yes, those sexist people need to wake up and smell the coffee, but it's not the job of every single liberal to work twenty four seven to accomplish this.

Back to your original point. Stealing ideas and holding people down is wrong no matter who does it or why, and it's even worse in a movement that really tries to do the opposite. I'm going to try to see this happening speak up about it in the future. Not that I'm active right now, but I will be again.
vass: Small turtle with green leaf in its mouth (Default)

[personal profile] vass 2008-04-13 02:30 pm (UTC)(link)
I just got up to the part (comment #28) where she said she doesn't care about racism the larger picture because they didn't ask nicely were too angry accused her of appropriation. She says this isn't theoretical, it could seriously affect her career. Unlike racism, which, thankfully, is totally hypothetical and doesn't really affect anyone in any way.

I don't think I can read any further.

I'm still a feminist (yield that ground to *her*? uh, no) but if a POC argues that it's a movement for white women to gain privilege at the expense of POC? I can see that. Certainly some feminists are. And I don't want to ally myself with those feminists.

[identity profile] bibliotech.livejournal.com 2008-04-13 04:00 pm (UTC)(link)
I don't know what to say to this, and anything I do say, I probably shouldn't say here (not that any of it would be remotely negative, just that every now and then I'm a little shy). But I'm reading and re-reading it and processing it.

No, I'll edit to say this much: in the past year or so, quite a few people have drawn away from me for saying that I don't think/feel that feminism is for WOC. Not much, hardly at all, maybe not even a little, who knows. And I've been told over and over that it's just that I don't "understand" what feminism is, that it's on me for not getting the true message of "this isn't for you", and while I'm sad that it took something like this to make my position understandable and not just be a case of me being an Typical Angry Black Woman who can't find a dictionary, I really wish it hadn't been necessary that it comes to this. I'm really going to miss that site, but I don't blame her for leaving. I'm hoping this doesn't affect the WOC blogosphere in general, because I depend on it so much for community and conversation that I can't get anywhere else.

[identity profile] meimi.livejournal.com 2008-04-13 08:51 pm (UTC)(link)
Holy crap. That Amanda lady's behavior in the comments of the Feministe post is disgusting. Total turn off. I cannot understand how someone who would crow from the rooftops about being a feminist would so blatantly write off the concerns of other women as them just "beun jelus". Does not compute.