I was thinking about Proposition 8 again, of course.

[cimorene]

I don't post about it every time I think about it because then I would be posting all the time, but it got tangled up in some other issues in my head and so I present this poll, because I really don't know how other people deal with this issue. So I would welcome discussion in the comments.

Obviously, I am aware that there are different levels of moral outrage. Most people are accustomed to sucking it up and maintaining relationships with people who hold some values we consider repugnant. And pretty much everyone would say that they couldn't maintain their respect and friendship without discomfort for a murderer or someone who had committed a similar violent crime. That's why I chose the examples I chose within the poll - meant to indicate the range of issues I specifically intend the poll to apply to. In other words, the range of issues over which these related social questions don't seem ridiculous...

[Poll #1305293]

Comments

[tilney.livejournal.com]

I learned recently that my father thinks it's a catastrophe that Obama won the elections, that it's the end of the era of the white man. Don't ask, I don't know either. So anyway, this is tangled up with many other issues I have with him, but now I mostly don't talk to him. It's shocking, and yes, I totally lost the last bit of respect I had for him. I mean, what do you even say to something like this?

[dana-kujan.livejournal.com]

Hmmm... I'm not sure I can take this poll. I think there's a vast difference between being a Republican and being a racist. Two examples:

1) I have an employee who is very conservative (though supportive of gay rights) and a proud Republican. We've had a lot of interesting/intense conversations/debates. But I am closer to him (values-wise, emotionally) than almost anyone else in my office.

2) Finding out that Mel Gibson is an anti-Semitic ass broke my heart, and I lost all respect for him. I don't find him attractive anymore, nor can I enjoy his movies. (Bonus: Michael Richards didn't break my heart because I could always take or leave him; I can still watch Seinfeld re-runs without his behavior cloudy Kramer's scenes-- though at first, I had to will myself not to think about his meltdown.)

[cimness.livejournal.com]

Yeah, it's not conservativism per se, just a lot of other qualities highly correlated with neoconservatism and Republicanism in my experience: anti-abortionism, racism, sexism, people unsupportive of gay rights, xenophobia (including prejudice against immigrants and the English-first movement), prejudices against the poor and welfare recipients, religious intolerance (I here include Christian prayer in public school, Creationism in schools, opposition to sex education, and posting of the Ten Commandments in a courtroom, all of which were majority-supported in Alabama when I was in high school).

[mirabile-dictu.livejournal.com]

Businesses are easier for me -- if I don't approve of them, they don't get my money. Of course, that makes buying gasoline a bit of a challenge these days. And people at a distance, like Mel Gibson or that horrible Mormon homophobic asshole, they're easier to ignore.

But people in my life who hold views I find distasteful . . . well, it depends. I'm a vegetarian, but as long as people don't force meat on me, I can deal with them eating it in front of me. I don't know many people who voted for McCain, but the few I do I feel sorry for because clearly they just don't have the big picture, and maybe they can't. But people who voted in favor of Prop 8? No one I know has admitted it to me and frankly, I doubt anyone I know would have, but I would have a very very difficult time being civil to them. So it's a huge, messy continuum.

And I agree with you: it's neo-conservative. I grew up in Barry Goldwater country, and he would be horrified by what's passing as conservatism these days.

[eleveninches.livejournal.com]

It depends on the severity of the issue, ie. I could respect a Republican (not everyone is a Republican for the same reasons), but I couldn't respect a racist or a homophobe.

[brownbetty]

I think it would also depend on my prior relationship. And then there's family, which is another barrel of fish.

[emmuzka.livejournal.com]

I live in Finland, Europe, so in here it's not about being republican, or conservative, but being a neo nazi/right winger wrapped in a tidy suit of one opposing current foreign policies. One of these right wing politics wrote a couple of weeks ago in his blog that the current foreigner policy was the Green Party women's fault, and that he hoped that when the foreigner commit rapes, the Green Party women would be their victims. O_O And that probably fall under the freedom of speech...

[buddleia.livejournal.com]

*sings* It depends, it depends.

My ex-gf used to say that I was a snob who wouldn't take the time to work on someone's prejudices. She's quite right.

[guinevere33.livejournal.com]

I rarely if ever boycott businesses based on their owners' proclivities, mainly because I'm convinced that most businesses are run by amoral scum. If I started trying to rule them out, I'd be left with nowhere to shop. (I also feel this way about cruelty free/environmentally friendly food. You just can't win.) That being said, I avoid Walmart and Exxon whenever I can, because, well, you know.

People are another matter. I've had friends (fellow scientists!) come out of the closet as Creationists and anti-abortionists, and now I avoid talking to them as much as humanly possible. My respect is gone, and I can't ever see them in the same light again. The same goes for anyone who says "that's so gay" or refers to ethnic minorities as "those poeple". I'm done with them.

ETA: Authors fall somewhere in between. For instance, I like Orson Scott Card's work enough to ignore the fact that he's a crazy Mormon. However, discovering that Piers Anthony is a misogynist totally soured me on ever wanting to read his stuff again; same for CS Lewis and Christianity, and all the Narnia books actually being about Jesus. Perhaps it's the degree to which it colors their work that makes the difference for me.

[cimness.livejournal.com]

Yeah. Well: there's such a thing as fair trade or locally raised vegetables, as well as organic produce. All of those are good. But cruelty-free animal raising? Hah! Not if they weren't raised on someone's personal little farm.