Difference between badfic and bad visual fanart and the philosophical vortex of taste and judgment?

[cimorene]

I can totally understand why people like badfic, and mediocrefic, and stuff that's competently executed but uninteresting to me. Aside from hatereading and just enjoying it anyway because it's funny, there's a whole world of ideas and some people simply care about different aspects of canon and want different things from what they're reading. Sometimes they don't care at all about simple standards that other people consider fundamental to a good reading experience - like, you know, punctuation, or coherence - and care exclusively about other things that other people, like for instance me, only want as far from our reading material as possible, like a certain style of characterization or a particular kink. Those people are out there making and consuming fanfiction for each other and having a good time, and the presence of the stuff they enjoy making it harder to find the stuff I enjoy is just an unfortunate side-effect of it coexisting in the same fandom; nobody's failing at anything, except our community at creating filterable tags that reliably separate the two subgenres.

But looking at bad fanart is completely different. Obviously producing less expert and less sophisticated art is a normal and natural outcome of an artist practicing and honing and perfecting their skills. And the fact that not everybody notices, for example, when the joints don't go the right direction and other anatomical impossibilities is adequately proved by the Hawkeye Initiative. There's a further swathe of variation in results that works analogously to the situation with written fanworks, because people find different styles appealing, or different effects.

But there's definitely a lot of fanart that is just not good, like because it visibly is trying and failing to capture the likeness of a particular actor, for example, or because it mostly manages to achieve a style but then loses it in spots and winds up with, you know, a giant hammer instead of a foot - the kind of stuff you see in janky anime that was produced on a low budget and a too-short deadline. It's often impossible for me to imagine the artist failing to notice the problem when it's a question of a spotty result like this.

And beyond that, the much bigger question is: what is driving other people to share bad fanart? Can it really be THAT common that what fans are interested in and value in fanart doesn't include a realistic work actually resembling the character it's trying to capture? (To say nothing of all the other elements of a work of art.) What DO those people want out of fanart? Sometimes it seems that some people don't want anything out of fanart at all - that their attitude is like that of a primary school art teacher, and the entire value of the fanart to them is in the fact that somebody was moved to make it. Which philosophically is fine and admirable, like from the point of view of an archivist, or a debate about fanworks and community... but is a weird standard to apply for sharing art on their personal blogs. Unless they just have a blog dedicated to every piece of fanart in X fandom they can find, in which case carry on, because at least that's what it says on the tin.

Comments

[princessofgeeks]

When you say "the entire value of the fanart to them is in the fact that somebody was moved to make it" I think you have it right there.

The fact that someone is interested in the same things we are, that they are creative, doing something for the community audience -- for some, that right there is enough.

If my kid or someone I love makes me a piece of art and it's not well executed, I don't reject it. I see the love and overlook the rest.

You are right that everyone has different standards for sure. And that's okay.

[goss]

I totally get your frustration in trying to sift and find the desirable-to-you works amidst the sea of everything else. /o\

What do people want out of fanart? And why promote artworks that aren't particularly "good"?

I would say exactly all the reasons you brought up:

- For authors especially, the fact that someone was moved enough to produce something inspired by their words is a huge factor, that often has nothing at all to do with the quality of the work.

- I have noticed that although having a likeness to an actor does tend to enhance a piece of fanart, it's not especially jarring to me if it doesn't. I think there is a certain amount of creativity in capturing a character based on qualities other than physical resemblance, which I often pick up on and appreciate beyond just a straight-up likeness.

- With some kinds of media like with books or animation, it's interesting to see different visual interpretations of characters, regardless of how realistic they look.

- With technology being what it is today, one could easily do a photo-manipulation to create any scenario using an actual screencap, so you wonder why even bother with drawn art? I appreciate the human factor behind the creation of the fanart, flaws and all - the parts of it that make it different from a photo-manipulation.

- Fan-creations, whether it is cosplay, vids, icons, artworks, animation, stories, podfic, craftwork, etc. can vary in quality. Even the quality of feedback can vary depending on one's ability to analyze or express one's self clearly. But the thing we all appreciate is the enthusiasm behind it. So absolutely yes to the Primary school teacher thing you mentioned. *g*

- Practice does lead to improvement. And often times one needs encouragement to keep on practicing. I think we Creatives in fandom do recognize that. Having others encourage and motivate can be invaluable to a writer or artist's development.

I can't tell you the number of people who say to me that they used to enjoy drawing in high school, and never took it further. Maybe no one was there to cheerlead them forward. Reccing and sharing creative works that one enjoys (regardless of quality) might inspire an artist to keep going and continue to develop their skills.

Personally, I remember attempting to draw people in high school and was absolutely ABYSMAL at it. I was so frustrated with the results, that I literally never attempted to draw a person from that point forward until many years later when I first got into fandom.

I fell in love with my first fandom and was dying to make fanart, but knowing how bad I was at drawing people, I didn't have the confidence to try. Seeing the reception of other fanworks of varying quality was actually what propelled me to make a go of it once more. Regardless of quality, the encouragement from others kept me motivated to keep on practicing. Over the years my skills have definitely improved, even though likenesses are never an easy thing - it's still hit and miss. I found that initial enthusiasm by fandom to be invaluable in my development as an artist.

[james]

I feel like sometimes it's just seeking encouragement - the same reason writers share fic instead of just daydreaming in their heads. They want love and attention, and even if it isn't good enough maybe, they think, some parts are good enough for some positive attention.

Maybe they know the foot looks like a hammer but they're really proud of finally getting the eyes better. Maybe they think since it's all done for free they don't have time to fix the foot so it's this or nothing, and the fans would rather have something than nothing.

If the artist never shared their work until it was really good, how would they get the motivation to keep trying? Maybe they can't tell, after working on it for a long time, what's even bad about it and what's even good about it anymore, so what the hell toss it out there for feedback.

Creating art or stories or anything in a vacuum isn't that much fun, and if you have a job or school and family stuff and other things to do, then spending yet one more hour trying to make the fanart better might not even be possible, and getting a little love from folks who are being kind and overlooking that janky foot is more joy than just trashing a piece of art because it isn't perfect yet.

(If the artist is trying to sell prints of sad art, then I think your comments are more relevant. But just sharing free art for free to fans, I think standards can be as low as the artist and audience is willing to accept.)

[cimorene]

Exactly, because in the context of a gift from someone you love, or the practice efforts of a child at making art, it is the fact that they did it that's relevant! But people who don't just share and promote the works of their friends and children and loved ones, but also don't share and promote every work they encounter, are evidently selecting on the basis of some other standard, one that's confusing to me to parse.

[cimorene]

It's certainly not required that fanart try to capture the likeness of a character. I was specifically talking about cases where they evidently were aiming in the direction of a likeness, but wound up looking like a completely different person. As you and I and anyone who has spent much time trying to portray people knows, that is by far the most frequent way to fail at human portraits. It's not very usual for them to wind up looking inhuman or anatomically impossible; it's way more likely for them to simply look like a completely different human. Similarly, there's lots of fanart that doesn't really resemble the actors or the canon art but where it's clear that the appearance is part of the style, and that also isn't an example of a failed attempt at something else. But I see plenty of fanart that clearly is a failed attempt at likeness too.

It's good that people get encouragement and feedback, and it's even more important when they're developing their skills as an artist, you're absolutely right. I'm just not convinced that those motivations really plausibly cover the behavior of fans who share and promote the fanart. I mean, definitely a majority intend encouragement to the artist to occur, and most likely many of them like some part of the work and find it worthwhile or interesting in spite of some other part that's not as good, which is how people react to fiction and poetry etc too.

But I think I don't see very much of people making a real effort to promote and share every piece of fanart they encounter (in their corner of fanworks), which is the approach that that philosophy should suggest. I mean, I've seen a few, but the majority aren't sharing everything, but selecting things by some other set of standards. Perhaps it's criteria unrelated to the successfulness or skillfulness or visual appeal of the work - the mood or theme, or the idea, or something like that. Maybe it's some kind of intuitive blend of vibes.

[cimorene]

Oh yeah, I don't find it hard to understand why a fanartist themselves shares their own work. The motivations are roughly the same as for a fanfiction writer! And regardless of what the creator thinks about the quality of the fanwork, it's demonstrably worth their time to share it and participate in the fandom conversation.

There are times when I find it hard to empathize personally with a creator posting some fanwork because it was made with less time and care than I would have spent on something I was going to post, but I know there are plenty of other people who aren't bothered by that, just as I know there are extroverts out there who like large, noisy parties full of strangers.

It's the sharing and promotion of other people's fanwork - well, fanart specifically, for me - that leads me down a philosophical rabbithole. It seems clear to me that most people are exercising judgment and not simply sharing and promoting everything for the sake of encouraging other artists; but they often seem to be standards I can't guess from looking at the things they share.

[goss]

I was specifically talking about cases where they evidently were aiming in the direction of a likeness, but wound up looking like a completely different person

Heh. I honestly don't have a problem with this, since I personally do this all the time!

I will attempt to draw a character, and their face comes out looking very human, but just a completely different face to the actor. (In fact, I just had this happening with a piece of fanart that I made last month for a Reverse Big Bang. I have since made my peace with it, and the writer who chose it was delighted by the art, despite that lack of accuracy.)

So I am thinking that for many viewing it, this probably doesn't detract from other aspects of the art they connect with, such as mood, personality or scenario, since the feedback (from absolute strangers) tends to be fairly positive in such pieces. Which leads me to believe that "successful" fanart of a character doesn't always hinge on the ability to replicate accurate facial features, even if one was attempting to do so and failed at it.

Perhaps it's criteria unrelated to the successfulness or skillfulness or visual appeal of the work - the mood or theme, or the idea, or something like that. Maybe it's some kind of intuitive blend of vibes

Yes, I believe this is probably what often guides people. Connecting with a piece of art can be personal and not always something one can pin down.

[princessofgeeks]

It might be fairly random! Certain characters, or attempted styles, or what they ran across that week. Hard to say.

[wynddancer]

I will share bad fanart because sometimes I'm in such a little fandom that it may be the only fanart I've found and I want to encourage the artist to continue and hope they improve while doing so.

I also hope others will see it and it will inspire them to make fanart of their own (especially better fanart).

I share bad fanart to showcase that someone likes that fanart and that other fanartists, who may or may not be bad, will be inspired to post their own fanart. Some fanartists think they're bad/not good enough when really they're much better than they think they are. Kind of, well that's terrrible, I can do better than that and if people like that, they'll probably like mine too even better. I want to encourage that mindset so they post their fanart.

[cimorene]

I've never thought of this before but this is actually an incredibly persuasive argument!😆